39 replies to this topic

[ignoramous]

A very interesting thread.

I have been teaching art through history (albeit Classical Civilisations) at my current school for the past two years at both AS/A2 and IB levels.

I find this particular area fascinating and do wherever possible try to do the same thing in my history lessons (cartoons etc).

The medium of ICT has proven to be invaluable to me when teaching class civ particularly as you can make the whole learning process interactive or independent for the pupils.

It is also good for opening pupil's eyes (no pun intended) so that they can take an item of their choice (art) and create their own presentations (so that I don't have to).

I don't know if anyone teaches classics but would be more than happy to send my efforts thus far should they be interested.


Ian

[JohnDClare]

Imagine what is going out outside the frame; what might have happened before.

What an excellent post this post by UlrikeSchuhFricke was!
In particular, 'what is happening outsdie the frame' is critical for all kinds of evaluation-of-source work.

One lesson I do with year 7s is on 'How Harold died'.
Most people's idea includes THIS scene from the Bayeux tapestry:


But what was going on outside the frame.

The full picture shows Harold in the centre of a ring of housecarls, and he is clearly being hacked down by a horseman. The man we THOUGHT was Harold is equally clearly just a guy in the shield wall!

To teach this I use a photograph which proves the point that what happens outside the frame is vital to understanding what is happening.
Start with this picture, and ask the pupils what is happening:

but after they have decided it is a mugging, show them this, the right-hand side of the picture!

This offers a suitable starter to the lesson the use of sources/how did Harold really die?
You show them this picture

[Andrew Field]

But John, you miss out the dots / stitch near the second man's eye. There is more too it that you say. See http://www.mrfield.b...rrow_in_eye.htm



Why were these added?
Why was the arrow taken away?
When were the added?
What does it all mean?

[JohnDClare]

Point well made, Andrew, and I am aware of your excellent stuff on this.
Note also, that William of Jumieges says that Harold died, 'fighting in the front line of his warriors' - so we might move towards some kind of synthesis explanation, where Harold is shown twice.

However, within the context of this thread, the point was the importance of what is going on 'outside the frame' in the evaluation of sources.

I'm trying to think of other situations where 'outside the frame' is of critical importance.

[Andrew Field]

Point well made, Andrew, and I am aware of your excellent stuff on this.
Note also, that William of Jumieges says that Harold died, 'fighting in the front line of his warriors' - so we might move towards some kind of synthesis explanation, where Harold is shown twice.

However, within the context of this thread, the point was the importance of what is going on 'outside the frame' in the evaluation of sources.

I'm trying to think of other situations where 'outside the frame' is of critical importance.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Fair enough. William of Jumieges also suggests part of his 'middle leg' was cut off too!

Looking 'outside the frame' is a great way of helping student evaluate sources generally. Any source can be examined in the way by drawing frames around them to evaluate what is being said and, most significantly, what isn't being said.

One excellent example of images would be the solider with the football from WWI. It looks like he is just playing around, but when you show the whole image it can be seen that they are leaving the trench. I'm sure there are lots of examples like this. If you have access to an interactive whiteboard / projector the 'spotlight' feature is especially useful when examining sources like this.

[D Letouzey]

The detail, for its own sake, in a painting, Daniel Arasse made nice comments about the italian painting. See the message on "L'escargot" (The snail)


A website I have already advertised, about the Bayeux Tapestry :
http://panograph.fre...uxTapestry.html

yesterday visit : The neue Pinacothek, in Munich (free for teachers).
with an impressive room on "la peinture d'histoire" around 1850.
Thusnelda or Jerusalem destroyed by Titus, it seems far away from the real world and from the painting which was on the way : Turner, Manet, Monet, Van Gogh, Gauguin or Cezanne...

Today, the alte : Durer, Le Greco, Rubens... and Van Dyck
http://www.pinakothek.de/

one book from Prestel, in German and in English :
From Lascaux to Picasso,
Paintings that Changed the World
by Klaus Reichold and Bernhard Graf

Found also David Dimbleby 's A Picture of Britain (Tate Publishing)

Daniel

Edited by D Letouzey, 08 August 2008 - 01:37 PM.

[Rookie]

Throw in a written primary source that gives a different interpretation of the person or event and get the students to compare this to the painting. Get them to discuss why the two are different. Words such as motivation, purpose, bias etc. will soon be flowing from their lips and they will be using their contextual knowledge to judge the validity or reliability of each of the sources.

or indeed throw in a photograph - particularly applicable to a topic such as ww1 and life in the trenches.

one of my favourite lessons in the whole of KS3 in in my enquiry into how to find out about life in the trenches, pupils frantically debating the comparitive usefulness of photos and paintings. an obvious starting point here would be 'gassed' and the famous photo depicting a similar image, but many others could easily be used.

the list of paintings (woodcuts/sketches etc) one can use in the classroom is nearly endless.

one example i use is a court for king cholera. the detail in the picture is excellent and particularly lower ability pupils gain so much from it, as stephen says the ability to access the information without it coming from weighty text or from the mouth of the teacher is great

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Perhaps another form of art - poetry - may be useful, such as the works of Owen Wilfred and Sigmun Sasson. Would a quick viewing of these works be relevent in a history lesson?

[D Letouzey]

Would a quick viewing of these works be relevent in a history lesson?

Last year, we have studied at the same time the Romanticism in history and in litterature. I did focus more on painting, on the social and cultural conditions.

Art history and politics.

The Angers Apocalypse tapestry was woven from 1375 to 1382, during the Hundred Years War. At the time of the deaths of Charles V and Edward III, what were the dangers according to Louis d'Anjou ?

http://alptraum.free.../trompette5.jpg

http://alptraum.free...sserie/lion.jpg

http://alptraum.free.fr/f/graphisme/apocal...rie/11'.jpg

St John 's Apocalypse :
http://www.earlychri...lation-kjv.html

Daniel

[D Letouzey]

Always in French, Daniel Arasse again :

a 2003 conference (UTLS):
http://minilien.com/?y6ROnhd6Ob

Histoire de peintures, 25 days on France-Culture
http://clioweb.free.fr/art/arasse.htm

http://www.tv-radio....EDE20060316.ram
(Just change the end of the address (it is a date) :
20060227.ram
20060301.ram...

bonne écoute
Daniel

[D Letouzey]

I have updated a "Teaching history through Art" webpage :
http://clioweb.free.fr/art/arthist.htm

see also http://clioweb.free....t/peint5014.htm
and http://clioweb.free....rt/florence.htm

History Painting on Wikipedia
Hierarchy of genres on Wikipedia

Daniel

Edited by D Letouzey, 08 November 2007 - 11:06 AM.