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#1 Dafydd Humphreys

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Posted 27 March 2003 - 07:05 PM

Checking my stats and referrers I notice that there are some links through to my site from 'Historyonline'. I can't access this site as it is a commercial, subscription, e-credits type site. They are obviously using a page on my site for a linked resource.

I feel objections to this as it is only accessible to those who pay for access.

What shall I do?
My Youtube Channels: <a href="http://www.youtube.c...m/Learnhistory" target="_blank">LearnHistory</a> (RIP) :( and <a href="http://www.youtube.c.../Learnhistory2" target="_blank">LearnHistory2</a> and now <a href="http://www.youtube.c.../Learnhistory3" target="_blank">LearnHistory3</a>

#2 Carole Faithorn

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Posted 27 March 2003 - 07:20 PM

I feel objections to this as it is only accessible to those who pay for access.

What shall I do?

Firstly .... you can access the site. You can take out a free trial and thus check to gain the facts about the link to your site.

As to what you do then ..... my feeling would be that you write/phone/email and explain your objections to having your freely available materials accessed from a 'pay for' site and ask them to remove the link. If that is what you feel.

I took a free trial of this site last summer. I believe I have said before that I thought this was the best of the subscription sites (or it was then in my opinion), but that I consider 'our' sites to be better - and free :)

#3 Andrew Field

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Posted 27 March 2003 - 08:19 PM

... and look at it from the positive side - a commercial site that offers resources for teachers has chosen to link to you. A sign of their respect for your quality materials.

What will be interesting is exactly how they have linked to your site - if it is in a new window or clearly shown as a different site - I wouldn't worry that much. If the link isn't clear - if it isn't obviously that the user is being taken from their 'pay-for' site to your site, then there is something to look into.

My attitude to things like this is to see it that I've put materials online for free and if they are showing others the route to such materials then so be it. As long as they aren't being passed off a part of their subscription materials then don't worry.

Let us know what happens.


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#4 Dan Moorhouse

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Posted 27 March 2003 - 09:04 PM

I find this rather odd. HistoryOnline have contacted me numerous ties to ask for my permission for them to link to pages. Indeed I think they've asked for permission to link to each individual page, which is excessive requests if anything.

If you are unhappy about them linking to you site I'd e-mail them, they've always been very approachable when I've spoken to them - and no, they haven't paid me anything - yet.

#5 Andrew Field

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Posted 27 March 2003 - 09:10 PM

I'm changing my mind on this now.

I've just been searching through curriculum online to see how my school can best spend some further funding we've discovered. Just to see what is available, I had a look at KS3, History, Norman Conquest.

I may be completely wrong and incorrect about this, but this really doesn't look good or seem fair. There's a few 'pay-for' resources such as purchase a CD-Rom on Norman castles. Seems to make sense.

Yet there's then links to specific resources such as http://www.curriculu...A25E740D76B28E1
History Online - The Bayeux Tapestry and the World Wide Web
Resources on the Web provide the opportunity to take a new look at 'old' evidence.

If you click to follow this link, you're then taken to a page to purchase a subscription to HistoryOnline - the full deal, not just the single resource.

I'm fully prepared to be wrong about this, but it just appears wrong to me. I don't know whether this is what's happened with your materials Dafydd, but this doesn't show Curriculum Online in any better light.

I then see the Learning Curve materials listed - rightly so. Following the links to the Public Record Office's site - http://learningcurve.pro.gov.uk I now see they are a 'Curriculum Online Registered Content provider'. Yet all their stuff is free.

I was denied membership of this because all my materials were free.

What's going on here? :crazy: :blink: :wacko:


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#6 Dafydd Humphreys

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Posted 27 March 2003 - 09:17 PM

I'm waiting for the reply-back to their free trial. I did enlist months ago but after 30 minutes got a bit bored. Certainly wasn't worth the charge.

I am fundamentally against the use of pay-per-view internet sites, especially for education. As are many 'HaCkErZ'....who can be very helpful if you know what I mean.... B)
My Youtube Channels: <a href="http://www.youtube.c...m/Learnhistory" target="_blank">LearnHistory</a> (RIP) :( and <a href="http://www.youtube.c.../Learnhistory2" target="_blank">LearnHistory2</a> and now <a href="http://www.youtube.c.../Learnhistory3" target="_blank">LearnHistory3</a>

#7 Carole Faithorn

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Posted 27 March 2003 - 09:56 PM

What's going on here?  :crazy:  :blink:  :wacko:

Discrimination. 'One law for the rich/government agency and another for the poor/you'

#8 Dafydd Humphreys

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Posted 27 March 2003 - 10:03 PM

The internet has to be defended from the people who wish to turn it into an 'AOL Keyword' kind of catalogue.

Luckily there are a lot more techie types out there who are always a few steps ahead of the corporations.

I think the Learning Curve site is great if a little 'British Museum'. Its up to the likes of us to make it useable. After all - the PRO site is ours - we paid for it through taxation, as with the excellent BBC site.

How long before the Blair regime sell off the Learning Curve to Micro$oft or AOL Time Warner I wonder....
My Youtube Channels: <a href="http://www.youtube.c...m/Learnhistory" target="_blank">LearnHistory</a> (RIP) :( and <a href="http://www.youtube.c.../Learnhistory2" target="_blank">LearnHistory2</a> and now <a href="http://www.youtube.c.../Learnhistory3" target="_blank">LearnHistory3</a>

#9 neil mcdonald

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Posted 28 March 2003 - 07:56 AM

This is certainly one of the things I was going to bring up in my GTCE project. How can we be our own masters of the e-learning environment when we get such discriminatory practice? They are talking about meeting up with policy makers and I will raise it as an issue (But not until November.)
Bernard Woolley: Have the countries in alphabetical order? Oh no, we can't do that, we'd put Iraq next to Iran.

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#10 johnmayo

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Posted 28 March 2003 - 09:37 AM

interesting and informative thread this :king:

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#11 John Simkin

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Posted 28 March 2003 - 10:44 AM

On principal I am not against subscription websites providing links to my website. However, I have found some websites disguise the fact that the material is actually on a free website. For example, they provide the material inside a frame that hides the actual URL and provides a heading from the subscription website.

Links from History Online is of limited value as it does not help your ranking in Google. The reason for this is Google does not take account of links from password based websites. It is therefore far more important to get links from high-ranking websites such as the BBC and the Guardian. For details of the link value of various websites see:

http://www.marketleap.com

History Online raises other problems. For example, it is mainly funded out of the subscriptions paid by members of the History Association. I would have liked to have thought that an association of history teachers would have used some of its revenue to provide free materials for classroom teachers.

#12 Russel Tarr

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Posted 29 March 2003 - 11:19 AM

I feel undiplomatic today. In my opinion History Online is rubbish. I checked it out using the free trial and it was turgid and utterly devoid of inspiration. Usually I'd be qualified in my criticism but when they have the cheek to charge hard-pressed schools for third rate materials then my ire is unbounded.

"There's an old saying about those who forget history. I don't remember it, but it's good" - Stephen Colbert

#13 jo norton

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Posted 29 March 2003 - 07:39 PM

We were subscribed to it for a year - new activities/ updates appeared very sporadically and were worth very little. Downloads did not work documents did not open and very few of the materials worked on macs (we are a mac based school) - despite being word/ppt files etc.
All in all it was not worth a penny - particularly when this site and many other free sites offer so much - how can they justify the amount? The subscription is definitely not being renewed! :huh:

#14 Dan Lyndon

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Posted 01 April 2003 - 07:57 PM

I agree with Russel and Jo. It was rubbish.
Until the lion has a historian of his own, the tale of the hunt will always glorify the hunter.
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#15 Dave Wallbanks

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Posted 01 April 2003 - 10:13 PM

I hate to say it but isn't this the work of the Historical Association and ACTIS? If so my subs are going into it and it would appear no-one likes or wants it. This leads me to think that they should both be told about this thread and they should seek some constructive advice from the people who make websites for history teachers as to what's good (stress the positive) and what needs the improvements (stress the positive and the possibilities). Does anyone from the HA ever look at this site? What constructive criticism could we offer? Possibly give a few of us some free access and a checklist to review (although all the best reviews I've read have been by Russell)
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