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Oliver Cromwell: Hero Or Villain


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#61 moneygall

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Posted 27 April 2012 - 01:29 PM

<span style='font-size:14pt;line-height:100%'>12 Reasons Cromwell is a HERO</span>

Oliver Cromwell is my hero, so here's some things he did that are great:
1. He substantially won the Civil War, when the rest of the Parliamentary commanders - posh, half-baked lords - would have lost it.
2. He set up the New Model Army which has to be one of the best armies the world has ever known - merciless and motivated fighters.
3. He could be ruthless when needed (eg against the Levellers, and at Drogheda and Wexford). Nowadays, in our politically-correct, wishy-washy liberal society, everybody goes 'ooo no, what a nasty man - he is the 'British Stalin'' at this. But AT THE TIME that was what people responded to (compare what was happening in France and Spain at the same time). The result was that England and Ireland HAD PEACE, because of Cromwell. Only someone of immense strength and imposing character could have FORCED such a warlike situation into peace.
4. He absolutely wopped the Scots AND the Irish - always a crowd-pleaser.
5. He pushed through the execution of the king, thus getting rid of a TOTAL TYRANT and establishing in English politics that a king CANNOT be absolute. Thus we owe our democracy to him - he is sometimes called 'the daddy of democracy'. How's about that for a hero?.
6. He threw out the old corrupt Rump Parliament in 1653. Everybody agrees that they deserved it. He really tried to establish a 'righteous' parliament in its place (eg the Barebone's Parliament).
7. He refused the crown when it was offered him - he genuinely did not want power for power's sake - just to get ENGLAND safely through this troubled period. Decent guy.
8. He abolished bear-baiting, and punished drunkenness. Perhaps he went too far for our tastes nowadays (he also abolished dancing, Christmas and the theatre) but this is what godly people wanted in those days. He was just trying to make people be good by the lights of the time.
9. He allowed Jews to return to start living in England, and allowed them religious toleration. He allowed everybody else to believe what they wanted - in their own homes - this was religious toleration way ahead of its time.
10. He built up the British navy - this was the real start of England's naval supremacy.
11. He captured Jamaica from the Spanish - and thus began the British Empire.
12. He was a good, decent family man, who enjoyed a joke and was kind to his children, and he always spent the day in prayer before he did any really outrageous thing. When he had lords to a meal, he would let them eat for so long - after which he would bang a drum, at which the ordinary soldiers were allowed to come in and take anything they wanted off the table.



Depends on your perspective,If he had never gone to Ireland there is a case for hero.Many respect his warts and all style character . His acts in Ireland where he demanded unconditional surrender will blight his name forever.As result of brutal invasion,sorry crusades, 1/4 of Irish population decimated,thousands of Irish women and children pushed onto basic slavery,(Jamaican sugar plantations). 40,000 forced by survival into conscription to overseas armies , 100,000's forced to leave the country,famine due to scorched ground policy.This invasion was a reaction from disposed catholics killing 4000 protestants and a further 8000 dying(uk history books) after being forced into exile from there plantations.There is still a lot of propaganda and emotive debate about this relating to statistics.Cromwell acts brought about an attempted reservation for irish behind the Shannon,the transference of wealth from catholic to protestant led to famine .Cromwell leads to very emotive debates over acts and statistics of dead.There are still debates about this and about the population of Ireland pre famine 8-10 million post famine 3 million. The argument "sure that was the times" is usually taken by the colonisers the victors .Below is a link ,though i dont believe Ireland would have won this war, i found it amusing that a battle led by a " politician " rather than a general with disastrous results was Irelands last attempt in open battle.To the victors go the spoils of recording history. copy and paste below for RTE documentary.



#62 MrJohnDClare

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Posted 27 April 2012 - 03:23 PM

Thanks for this contribution.

#63 HistoryKid

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Posted 23 February 2013 - 05:27 PM

Hi I am suffering from the same problem as i have a essay due about him being a hero or villain please could anyone say some facts on him being GOOD and maybe some BAD points aswell i will be much appreciated if you do .  :D



#64 HistoryKid

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Posted 23 February 2013 - 05:28 PM

 

the essay may take you a lot of time ,searching information is not the only way to do it

... and what way is that?

 

Books, family members



#65 Mr. D. Bryant

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Posted 23 February 2013 - 07:51 PM

Hi I am suffering from the same problem as i have a essay due about him being a hero or villain please could anyone say some facts on him being GOOD and maybe some BAD points aswell i will be much appreciated if you do .  :D

Welcome to the Forum.

 

Have a look at page 1 of this very thread; this should give you some ideas.  If there isn't enough material, do a forum search on 'Cromwell' and you'll find there is plenty more.  Good luck.



#66 Guest_myahya_*

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Posted 22 March 2013 - 06:53 PM

I need help on what websites to look at for finding sources why people like oliver cromwell and why people dont



#67 MrJohnDClare

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Posted 22 March 2013 - 07:46 PM

I need help on what websites to look at for finding sources why people like oliver cromwell and why people dont

Good question!

FOR CROMWELL:
There is an organisation called 'The Cromwell Association', and why don't you try googling things like: Cromwell appreciation to find some other sites.
 
AGAINST CROMWELL:
Most Irish sites are going to be anti-Cromwell, and I would google things like: oliver cromwell mass murderer to find some other sites.



#68 pupil498

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Posted 27 March 2013 - 07:25 PM

Why was charles I  to blame for civil war????



#69 MrJohnDClare

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Posted 27 March 2013 - 07:44 PM

Why was charles I  to blame for civil war????

Try here.

 

We like people to say please and thank you on this forum - it's just polite.

Everybody else does so.



#70 meggymoo

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Posted 08 July 2013 - 02:55 PM

when i started this topic, i was practically ripping my hair out, so some help would be absolutely lovely, but first let me tell you something- when he first took the thrown, he refused to take the name of king, so he was called 'lord protector', he quoted-"the lord is the only one capable of choosing those for power, he did not chose me so I shall not disobey him” please help, thanks  :rolleyes:  



#71 Mr. D. Bryant

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Posted 08 July 2013 - 03:41 PM

when i started this topic, i was practically ripping my hair out, so some help would be absolutely lovely, but first let me tell you something- when he first took the thrown, he refused to take the name of king, so he was called 'lord protector', he quoted-"the lord is the only one capable of choosing those for power, he did not chose me so I shall not disobey him” please help, thanks  :rolleyes:  

Welcome to the Forum.

 

What did you want to know?



#72 meggymoo

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 05:09 PM

I would like to know what he did to be known as a villain, as I have no clue as to what to put in the "he was a villain because..." section, so and info on that would be much appreciated, thanks.    



#73 Mr. D. Bryant

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 06:33 PM

I would like to know what he did to be known as a villain, as I have no clue as to what to put in the "he was a villain because..." section, so and info on that would be much appreciated, thanks.    

 

Right then.  Go to page 1 of this very thread and read through some of the posts and note down examples of Cromwell being a villain.  For example, make sure you find o0ut what he did in Ireland.  Then, when you have done this, get back to us if you have any questions about what you have found.



#74 meggymoo

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Posted 11 July 2013 - 02:26 PM

thank you for the info, i found it a very good help, i now have enough info for the last part of my essay. :)  :D   



#75 meggymoo

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Posted 11 July 2013 - 02:37 PM

 

I would like to know what he did to be known as a villain, as I have no clue as to what to put in the "he was a villain because..." section, so and info on that would be much appreciated, thanks.    

 

Right then.  Go to page 1 of this very thread and read through some of the posts and note down examples of Cromwell being a villain.  For example, make sure you find 0ut what he did in Ireland.  Then, when you have done this, get back to us if you have any questions about what you have found.

 

thank you, i appreciate the help!  ^_^ 






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